But there really is no best answer its all subjective. Lynn, Incidentally, what we believe to be generally true is that its not just clones, but also respected component brands where the single biggestdifferentiationbetween their product and that of the big OEMs isnt performance, but rather polish. Also illegal is a club that is very close to a direct copy and is termed either confusingly similar (if it infringes on company trademarks) or substantially similar (if it infringes on design patents). Note I'm 68 and using A flex but with the right shaft for your game they will play to any flex. First let me say that I am 88 years old and have been playing Hireko golf clubs, particularly their THRIVER for 8 years. You invest your time and should invest equally in your equipment. and components (i.e., Alpha, Hireko, Golfworks, Snake Eyes, Wishon, KZG, etc.). Caveat, Ihave not built any of their(Hireko)newer models but I have with GolfWorks. Almost every golfer has an opinion about the topic when askedso we felt it would make for a great labs article. By the way, I played with an 86 yr old man and he had all mismatched clubs. Pinemeadows offers a lower end shaft as their standard, but you can upgrade too. The Heated, however, wellas much as I would love to tell you that it offers similar feel, I cant. I agree that most component companies copy other designs. Ive put them up against the latest and greatest and theres just not enough difference for me to rationalize a grand for off the rack. I have used the big brands like TaylorMade, component brands like Golfsmith, and unbranded clone clubs. I saw they also have a dual length set for people that just don't want to play long 6i length short irons. One of the two is a multiple major tournament winner. Having been in manufacturing all my life and seen what quality can and cannot be, I wonder about the quality of all clubs today. We do not. These perform great. Gap distance is very good and the strong lofts assist length in the 5, 6, 7 irons. I do proudly carry 3 PW Maltby MMBs (forged blades) with Project X shafts, custom fit to my length. Hmmmwe think maybe theres a chance it might.Lets go to the lab! Callaway threatened to sue Kent Graphtec over its Big Bursar driver, alleging patent, trademark and trade dress (trademark-design) infringement. I have the Dynacraft CNC forged wedge that's currently for sale on Hireko's site. I believe it was good for MGS to write about this since it eduates people about the other choices they have. Are there clones that are made with poor qualityYES. Im broke n in college so i wanted a cheap set of irons to get me started. It just isnt very admirable. Strong lofts with forgiving mishits and incredible feel. OK.today is going to be a good one golfspies! SWIFT) Sound and Feel TaylorMade has a reputation for producing great feeling, great sounding drivers. I think I am going to get some components and try building an over length set. And while I might argue that over the last couple of years theyve taken a small step backwards in those areas, they remain largely ahead of the curve. While the dual-crown technology is visible in both, on the TaylorMade Burner its much more subtle and refined. Should be fun as long as my wife does not find out I more clubs on the way. The topic were covering in Edition #2 of the MyGolfSpy Labs is one of the most debated topics the golf equipment industry has had for the past 30 years! All those statements do is hurt the component biz. I have hit them myself and compared a set of them with my name brand and really with the same shaft,,,, they were every bit as good and a bit better in some respects cause I made them to fit and every component was checked. You are right, though, that golf is an expensive game. . And I have the benefit of custom fitting and the best components. Counterfeit Clubs and Clones are more often manufactured in the same factories in China. He mentioned they also had design input on the Pinhawk heads too. So, of all the clubs Ive ever owned, one club was .7g past tolerance. You can also get many/most of their components from Value Golf (I'm not affiliated, other than as a customer). Clones fall within legal guidelines and do not have the same name, markings or overall design. After viewing product detail pages, look here to find an easy way to navigate back to pages you are interested in. Guest Delete That would tell us all something about OEM vs non OEM in general this test didnt do that. There is the direct counterfeit, which is a dead-on copy that carries the legitimate products trademark, and thats illegal. While the Burner produces a pleasant ting and outstanding feel at impact, the Heated was often described as clunky, almost heavy at impact. Great article! document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Asfar as the lower end of components go, the only ones that really deserve the bad rap are the "clones". Even the raw materials received were sometimes out of tolerance. Yup, found that article. It appears that you are debating the way he phrased the sentence. I need cheap clubs and their just as good. . The 2nd tier often makes some of the mid-size golf companies that a lot of you play but they also make some of the top components and clones for companies like. Just discovered Golf works and like their components as well. Tim Brogan, PGA Director of InstructionCallaway Master FitterTim is the Director of the 1757 Game Improvement Center. Quality is really poor. Oh , incidently, this thing about the heights of people I feel is not an important part of the fit. Definitions: . Now Im down to 6.3, been playing clone irons the whole time and usually Orkut drivers but not always and often times I play an 8 year old Taylor made r510 tp. Shop products from small business brands sold in Amazons store. Odyssey Putters; Clearance Golf Clubs Up to $180 Off TaylorMade Stealth Golf Clubs; PING G425 Golf Clubs; Shop All PING Golf Clubs; Super Game . How many of them are the clubs the least of their problems? Once the swing is dialed in, then perhaps rewarding yourself with an expensive set of clubs is a great goal. Director) believes that most stock shafts are good enough for the average golfer. While I cant speak for GolfSmith, Hireko is also considered partly a clone company. Regripping We offer all of the grips offered by Golf Pride, Lamkin, Winn, and Super Stroke. I give them 5 stars. Today is the ultimate test: Clone Golf Clubs (vs) Name Brand Golf Clubs. Oneday 8 years ago I saw an add from Hireko for their THRIVER. Counterfeits and Clones from the same cloth I have a loft lie machine in the basement, so no big deal. SWIFT, DON YAEGER. I cant say Ive chased the next new thing, only last year did I move the a 460 driver, of course I had to build three. Which they are doing, but it is costly. Not sure about Pinhawk, think they are their own entity. SOURCES Since early 2000, that practice has become more and more limited as the most contracts between OEMs and Foundries, prevent the foundry from producing Clones. Example, a set i built last year,.winn tac mac grips(the best)DTs smoke shaft,(as good as a 30dollar shaft)black& silver ferrells, and DTs cavityback blade heads in smoke/black color, (really sharp) with all 4 Diamond Tours wedges,.and 2 matching hybrids(#2,#3) with head covers,..BUILT for ME, (short man), so set was shortened cut,shafts spline alin, lie angle changed 2 degrees flat, loft angle adjusted, all assembly,packed, shipped to my door,..for I think it was around $ 450 +/- ! IMO, no they do not. Lets go back to Hickory shafted clubs, even then there were manufacturers inserting steel shafts inside. Our state-of-the-art studio bays hit out to a range that allows you to see the flight of the ball, we never fit into a net. So bottom line dont leave this subject here Golf Spy please do a test of clone irons! The only problems with clones is that there arent clone golf bags! Ive been on both ends of the spectrum: I bought the Sasquatch and 5000 when they were brand new, thinking Id get some sort of golfing nirvana with each new release. And, as they acquire them they would tweak the designs to what is available today. I actually built some Wishon/Sterlings (single length collaboration between Tom Wishon/Jacob Bowden) at multiple lengths (i.e. Counterfeit golf equipment is NOT the same as clone equipment. I wish you would have also tested the stock shaft on that clone driver. That's great feedback! I bought a pickup truck bed worth of components from the estate of a mom/pop club builder. Clones have come a long way since the dark ages. I was disappointed, but it lead me to all my other purchases, which in turn allowed me to develop the same conclusion that MGS showcased here. And also just so you know OEMs have almost always tried to prevent foundries from doing clone products at the same foundriesbut it happens everyday. Paying full freight is worth it if the performance dictates. I made my biggest improvements this year when I broke down and took a couple lessons from Derek Radley of Mobilegolflesson.com. The customs people thought my father was [the primary distributor of] King Snake, which in its heyday had something like 10% of the market, Jethro says, but a lot of people were importing that product. Do yourself a favor and spend the extra money you save on clubs with clones getting lessons to improve your swing. Given its what youre actually swinging. I cant say enough good things about the quality of the clubs I have purchased from Giga. Its not. I would actually like to see more tests done on off brand stuff, like the KZGs or Warrior custom golf (you know who you are, I played them to). https://www.hirekogolf.com/golf-components/clubheads/golf-irons/pinhawk-vertex-dual Always has been and always will be. For the beginner or high HC golfer, I highly recommend a good set of clones. Golf is a game of honor. It is less and less common. They own the other brands in their website by acquiring them over the years. So you are saying that geek golf that you run is just a spin off as well. I called Hireko and spoke to the guy who makes the videos (tech line). For those who want to play Knock-Offs, yes it is your right. I think the easiest way to decide is level of ur game vs. level of ur income. Our numbers suggest a clone offers more bang for the buck. Does anyone have any experience with any of the clubs, components, or company found at Hireko golf? You will get more than your money's worth, in my opinion. Its your money to spend where you chose I just found better places to spend it. There are other companies with their own designs not knock-offs nor clones. Just because something in a Chinese factory was allowed to happen, does not make it right. How about paint quality? Well today youre going to find out once and for all. No it wasnt exactly cheap to do, That said theres a good chance Ill die with these in the bag. I know Maltby designs their clubs but does Hireko design theirs? I didnt get an extra 10 yards and I wasnt dramatically more accurate. Visit the Cobra Golf Store. It may be understandable that we as consumers can be fooled by Counterfeits/Copies (Illegal), but there is no way anyone of us could not identify a Clone/Knock-Off (Legal). Clothing manufacturers have been battling this issue for many years. This is a topic Im always interested in. My perception of what I see around me is that golfers fall into two categories. Give me a web site that shows the difference names of club components and the quality of the components so I can make an informed decision so that I dont have to rely on a manufacturer who has advertised his name to be number one. Can you point me in the right direction? An excerpt from Pssst . Lie Angle Adjustments We can change lie angles to fit your golf swing in almost any golf club. Upload or insert images from URL. Purchasing used golf clubs is a great way to ensure you have quality equipment in your golf bag at the right price. But even this line is blurring with some of the reputable clone and component companies out there in recent years. Got it, thanks! Some of you that shout the accolades of name brand clubs and tell everyone else the pitfalls of playing clones you probably never hit a quality clone before. Both my Acer XKs and XFs were all either on spec or less than one gram off (.8g being the farthest off). The store will not work correctly in the case when cookies are disabled. GOOGLE Counterfeit Golf Clubs and take a look at how rampant it is. Hes a Cinderella story. Tony believes that golfers deserve to know what's real and what's not, and that means MyGolfSpy's equipment coverage must extend beyond the so-called facts as dictated by the same companies that created them. As mentioned above, I believe you should research more on this topic before writing an entire article denouncing the use of clone products. The clone guys will tell you that the name brand stuff is overpriced and doesnt perform any better than the OEM stuff they were designed to look like. Re-shafted mine with Axe Xcaliber SL graphite. I will say thisoften times the quality of things like welds, finishes and materials are not as good as the name brand model. Cookies help us deliver our services. As for the rest of the components that go into the club, some of the companies give you a choice of components. Normally shot between 16 and 21 over on the courses I regularly play. While not all their designs are clones, they do carry a large majority of clone heads (which is understandable as they started as a clone company). Not so many Hireko/Acer/Pinhawk. I have been researching single length clubs again and I may just have to order a few Pinhawks to build/test. so just pick the better heads, I think they do a good job building, but you might want to get the parts and find a builder (like the pro you got fitting) and get maybe a meticous build, swing weight matched closer maybe,.but for most, the low price is based partly on supplying work for their shop tooAnd dont just buy for looks,..get the stats, and match the right components for the performance you really want. I have bought several other Hireko clubs and have been totally satisfied. But the same thing can be said about some of the name brand models as well. I am/was a Dynacraft Class A clubmaker and a member of the old Dynacraft ProfessionalClubmakers Society. Reshafting These services usually take 5 to 7 days, as we have to order the shafts. Iron Set for Men (5,6,7,8,9,PW,AW,SW) Right Handed with Regular Flex Steel Shaft, WHI-711, Set 9 pcs(4,5,6,7,8,9,PW,GW,SW) or Individual, Iron 7 for Men Right Handed Golfers -(Flex- Regular), Kids Golf Set with Glove, Balls, Tees, and Towel, Golf Season is Here. He built mostly dynacraft stuff, so I got a lot of odd components from the 80s. Just a quick note to say i recently decided to take up golf. Spin While many manufacturers are promoting less spin off the driver, the truth of the matter is that the distance equation is far more complex than less spin = more yards. According to Jethro, the familys legal fees for the discovery phase alone came to more than $1 million.. In 1997 R.J. Liou reached a settlement with Callaway. While all the content of what you said may be correct there is more to clone/knockoff/etc. Guys, I have a fairly unique perspective on this issue. Ping, TaylorMade, Callaway, Nike, etc. Further, if the same tip diameter shaft (likely .335) is used for both, the shim that wouldve been used for the Burner would not effect the performance in any way. Being a designer in this industry I can tell you for a fact that some of the clones that are upper tier are designed in the same foundry that many mid to upper tier name brand models are designed in. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. They may have similar names Turner T7, Gallery, and so on. Your previous content has been restored. Tom Wishon, he himself a club designer who has his stuff made in the Far East, backs up MGSs facts. No Research and Design Costs. But both models tested were 460cc titanium drivers. I certainly believe there is little difference in shot results from an overall performance. Im glad the rental only cost me $15.00 any more and I would have been upset at myself renting them. A different animal than what the test was. Copyright 2022 MyGolfSpy I worked for Arnold Palmer Golf back in the dark ages and built and sold clones and knock offs for 20 years. Iwant to know why you didnt do the same for irons? The altered logo would be applied to the graphite shafts Yarn-Way was making for Lious Integra line. Anybody that uses a cheap clone head should be able to figure out why theres such a difference in price. .every year get fever,and build a new set of irons,..its a lot of joy, looking at sites,picking the pieces, then having them built just for me. Any test involving equipment using humans seems flawed the particants had to realize which club was being used and to completely eliminate that mental factor had to be impossible. A lot of research goes into the wood and as Frank Thomas once said, a 3 yr old Wood is obsolete with the technology of today. Clones come from the most of the same Chinese factories that produce Counterfeit clubs. Pinhawks are a separate entity, and they are pretty good. After all, there is no way on this green earth that a clone with an assembled price of less than $100 ($59 head only) could outperform a club from a popular golf company with an initial price tag of $300 right? Its about money and the lack thereof in 90% of those that buy clones! Golf Galaxy Certified Club Technicians use Note that Pinhawk is a I was somewhat disappointed. at this price, you can keep in trunk, travel without worrying to much,..the set the year before,i tried razer clone heads,got a little rust in grooves, and diamond tour took them back, and build me an upgraded set for small little extra,.! We were one of the first companies to import from China. I play a complete set of Ping I20s purple dot. KZG couldnt afford them. The brand doesnt seem to make much difference in quality to me. 2nd Swing offers the largest selection of used golf clubs both online and in our stores, including every brand and model imaginable. usually its the loft and lies that are way off but then you have the improper weighting/balance and the occasional head that goes flying down the range . Of course, this is my individual experience. Ill use Infiniti as an example. However: the result you provided does tell us that one club seems not twenty-five percent better to justify the cost difference, but as with a new suit, cost is a factor to most people some believing the lower cost buys the good-enough quality and some believe they deserve the best, and humans equate best with price. From what I understand Dynacraft was a big name with amateur club builders and both dynacraft and hireko did/do a lot of club building education and seminars. PING, in an older Golf Digest article, seemed pretty adamant that their stock offerings are on par with anything sold in the aftermarket. 5,6,7@ one length and 8-gw @ a shorter length) a year ago. How is the overall health of golf these days? My back and joints are grateful. Ive tried Hirekos Green Ghost and Blue Crush and DTGs FGS Nano and Id put them up against anything out there. I find much at MGS as interesting and informative. Test Taylormade drivers against a couple of the top tier non-OEM companies like Bang and Ill be interested in the results. I can only hit a drive about 180 anymore and the Thriver gets me there. Purchasing used golf clubs is a great way to ensure you have quality equipment in your golf bag at the right price. You will receive personalized attention from the initial interview through product delivery. HeIl, we may even have completely different views on what best means. However to say if we hit one thousand shots with the same club we can get a very good idea of our results. Club fitting should never be a guessing game.We incorporate Trackman technology the finest launch monitor fitting capabilities to insure each customer receives the best equipment for their individual swing. Oh and I like their hybrid and fairway wood models. Hireko acquired Dynacraft somewhere in the 2000s, I don't remember exactly when. The court ordered the defendants to pay $20,000 in damages to Callaway and to turn over their inventory of more than 11,500 infringing components for Callaway to destroy. For example it will look identical to the name brand model and even have the same name (ex: Taylormade R11 will be on both soles and look identical). Golfsmith has become really copy cattish lately, but mainly because they are throwing in the towel on the clubmaking side of it. the consumer. No Reps. No Service. I have to say I am more impressed now to the point of considering buying some components to actually test them.

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